A Conversation With Reuel Beats: Marketing Strategies and the Importance of Networking
Clint:
Yo Reuel, what's good bro. I appreciate you taking out the time to catch up with us and give us some insight on your career as a producer. So tell the people a little bit about who you are, what you do, and how you got started in music.
Reuel:
It all started from a genuine passion for making beats. My journey started back in 2009 - I’ve been making beats for that long. I started out on a terrible keyboard that you couldn't loop, so I just had to play everything over from the top every single time. [Regarding who I am,] I'm a content creator. I don't like to put myself in a box. I like to think of myself as a mentor in a sense. I’m not trying to overstand anybody of course, but I've been in the game and I might know more than your average producer just because I've been through the ringer. I've seen the ups and the downs. Airbit has been a great tool for me especially [since] you guys really helped me find a niche and really gave me the tools to cater to it.
Clint:
What was your original goal? A lot of producers get into production and they want to produce for major artists. So what was your motivation?
Reuel:
What's funny is I don't think I had a goal, honestly. My goal was just to be as sweet as Timbaland. There was Ryan Leslie and a group of people on YouTube named Mysto and Pizzi - they all used to have videos of them making beats. My goal was just to be sweet like them. Do you ever see people play basketball from the bench? They think they’re sweet as LeBron and they get out there and can't do a layup. That's how I was in my mind. I was that sweet. But when I got down on the keyboard, it was just like trying to make that happen. Listening back to those beats, they were really amateur sounding. I'm not gonna say they were bad or trash, but it's a tough listen for sure.
Clint:
What did you do in order to put yourself in the position to know that your beats were trash and then from there make improvements to get them up to industry standard? What was that process like for you?
Reuel:
Well, at the time, I was like 9 or 10 years old, so I didn't know that they were trash. I honestly thought they were the sweetest beats ever. I used to play them for everybody. Now, hindsight is 20/20, so [while] listening to them, I [wonder] “what was I thinking?” [and I’m able to take] an honest look at my music in comparison to what was on the radio. Mind you, my goal was never to be a Billboard producer, top 10, or have my own subgroup of producers. My goal was just to be a good producer. So seeing other people that were sweeter than me made me realize I'm not sweet yet and there's a lot more room to grow. So from that point on, it was such a slow process. When I first started [making] beats, it was still hardware based. People were making beats off of the Motif and the Fantom. So when I first started, there wasn't really a heavy presence [in softwares]. I think there was one of the earliest versions of FL - it didn't look like the FL now. I started off with FL but that’s not my main DAW right now.Back then, there wasn't a lot of information to learn. You didn't have access to what people have access to now. Now, you have producers sharing their entire drum kits and their entire preset bank. Back then, there was no preset bank - it was a keyboard sound. So I didn't know there were other tools and other sounds. I would say that I finally came into my own around 2015 or 2016. Mind you, I started in 2009, so it's a super long process of trial and error.
Clint:
Did you ever run into other producers who were further along to show you some things or were you just figuring everything out on your own?
Reuel:
It was rare for me to come across somebody that makes beats and actually showed me what they did because the culture of showing people what you do is kind of new. If you look at top 10 or legendary producers, they don't share the sauce. They don't give up the secrets. They hold [the secrets] really close to themselves. But now, there's a whole culture of [giving back]. And plus, now as far as the music, I think there's a lot more saturation. There's a lot of people that sound the same. There's a lot of “copy paste”, just mimicking what’s popular. It hasn't always been cool to sound like another artist or another producer. So I was fortunate enough to experience a time in the music game where it was cool to have unique drum sounds, unique melodies, or your own style. Now, I think that's a lot more rare as far as mainstream hip-hop.
Clint:
Did you stay in Detroit as you were growing in your career or did you relocate to be around more of a music scene in a different city?
Reuel:
When I first started, I ended up traveling to Atlanta, trying to build a network out there. It was a pretty fruitful experience because I ended up getting some placements. I remember going out to LA once or twice and I went to Paramount Studios. I linked up with people from here that had connections out there. That was a really cool experience for me. But I'm based out of Detroit now. So my advice to any aspiring producers would be to build something where you're at right now. I think in most instances, when you look at legendary acts, as far as producing, they built a network from where they were.
Clint:
You can reach so many people just by using the internet. You don't necessarily have to move to LA, ATL, or New York these days. You can build what you want to build and then still get people all over the world to hear your music, which is a great segue into selling and leasing beats online. How did you learn about that and what made you want to go that direction/build from there?
Reuel:
I had just moved back to Atlanta, man. I was sleeping on the floor on the air mattress. There were roaches around the crib, but I was so driven. My mind is strong. That kind of stuff doesn't bother me really. The only thing that bothered me about that time was my diet. I was eating ramen noodles for breakfast and that was the only meal for the day. That was a crazy time, looking back. [Anyways,] I have a friend whose name on Airbit is Kingdrumdummie. He used to stay way out in the outskirts of Georgia. We have a mutual friend named Joseph McFashion. He's a pretty popular guy out here. He has his own label, but he was tapped in with Drum. So I ended up driving out there and meeting him. He was huge on YouTube at the time. This is the first producer that I had ever met that was really big and making a living off of YouTube. The platform that he was using to sell beats was Airbit. So at the time, I had heard about SoundClick and stuff like people selling beats online. I remember going on there when Soulja Boy was popping and listening to Soulja Boy type beats. That was the height of SoundClick, I believe, and that was when I first learned about selling beats online. But I ended up meeting Tevin (Kingdrumdummie) and that's what he was doing. He was posting beats every day and he was making a killing. So at the time, I had read the book Rich Dad Poor Dad and it talks about entrepreneurship, finding a niche, and catering to that niche - that's similar to what [Kingdrumdummie] did. But I think in my case, I knew that there were no Detroit type beats online. I knew people here in Detroit only listened to Michigan artists, so I knew that there was an audience for it. I didn't know how big it was. I didn't know if it was gonna fail or not, but all I knew is that it was possible. So that's what really drew me to Airbit and I would just post every single day without fail. I looked at all the top YouTube personalities and I just followed their blueprint. I would become active on there and then I would get on Airbit and see what the top producers there were doing.
Clint:
You were pushing a lot of traffic from your YouTube channel. Is that how you were getting a lot of your beat sales in?
Reuel:
Yeah, I would say YouTube is the main driver of traffic to Airbit for me. I'm not sure what's going on on Google and Facebook because I don't use those platforms as much as I use YouTube. YouTube is definitely pivotal for me and I think other Airbit producers could really benefit from it. Airbit offers tools to monetize your YouTube and that isn't always easy to start off doing. You gotta get a million watch time hours and a thousand subscribers. It might have changed, but that was way back then. I know it was really tough for me getting started. It's easier when it gets going and you get a regular flow, but just starting off, Airbit has tools where you can start making money sooner. It might not be a crazy amount of money, but it's enough to inspire you to keep going. I'm really glad that you guys added that feature. I wish they had that tool when I first started.
Clint:
You mentioned something earlier that was a gem and a cheat code honestly. When you started, you were on Airbit looking at what the top producers were doing. I think that's super crucial because I always believe in order to be successful, you have to first figure out what works. And that’s exactly what you did. You’re not trying to reinvent the wheel or come up with some new genius way to be successful selling beats online. Like you've seen what the other successful producers on Airbit were doing - uploading every day and being consistent every single day. That’s how you were able to build the career that you have now.
Reuel:
That's the key man. You gotta aim for the stars and if you fall short, then you land on the moon. Another key to it is having enough confidence to know that you can compete at that level. Hadn’t it been for me thinking that I was capable to compete at that level, I wouldn't have looked at [the top producers]. I would've looked at somebody that's a little bit more commonplace or cool with [being] average. I've never been that kind of person. I feel like I can compete with anyone. So that's another thing - you always wanna go for the top. I'm the type of person who can't leave any stone unturned. I gotta leave it all out there or I can't sleep at night. If it doesn't work, I know that I tried.
Clint:
Aside from YouTube, are there any other things that you do now or maybe have implemented in your production business in recent years to continue to build your fan base and market music to the artists who support you?
Reuel:
I think the biggest tool is networking. Networking gets you places that hard work can’t. I went gold three times this year, so I just want people to know that you don't have to put yourself in a box necessarily. If I could do it, you guys can do it too. Outside of networking, marketing is a big key that most producers don't pay attention to. You gotta market yourself. Artists spend hundreds on an outfit, hundreds on a video, hundreds on a beat - maybe thousands even. As a producer, I think we think our job stops just at making a beat. I think you're selling yourself short. I think that most producers think that there's some kind of glass ceiling for producers. I don't believe that. Take a look at DJ Mustard. I'm not sure if he's a beat maker anymore, but he's transformed the lives of so many people and he’s definitely broken the mold of what your standard producer is. I think that's what people should strive towards. You definitely gotta market yourself to be bigger than just a beat maker.
Clint:
What would you say are your top two marketing strategies? Do you use a combination of social media ads and posting content? What's your approach when it comes to marketing yourself as a producer?
Reuel:
I think maybe a better question would be “what can everybody do?” It’s not even specific to me. The first thing you gotta do is know your audience. You gotta know who you’re trying to sell beats to. It doesn’t even have to be beats, it can be any product. [You need to ask yourself], “who is [my] target audience?” For me, I like to focus on the youth and specifically people in my area because I know what they might be looking for. I think the biggest tool for me in reaching them is social media, whether it be Google Ads, Facebook Ads or just any platform I know offers promotion too. So I think the key is just knowing what people are gonna be receptive to and then pushing it. I'm really heavy on Instagram marketing. I think outside of social media, people wanna see that you're successful. It’s kind of weird, but people gravitate to things that they already know work. When you go into the grocery store, you're gonna go for what you know and what people like. People aren’t getting an off brand bag of chips before they get Lays or Doritos. They’re going to the brands that they see are marketed and are popular. So you gotta do something to make yourself appealing. I think that the first step is knowing who you're trying to market to and then figuring out your tools to reaching that audience. You gotta find the balance between what's the most feasible for you and the most effective. I think once you figure that out, you can really start to lay the groundwork for reaching [more people].
Clint:
Speaking of social media, did you ever go through a period where you were like “let me see which one is better - Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter” or did you just start seeing a lot of traction on a certain platform and then you just kept focusing on that?
Reuel:
Growing up in high school, you kind of gravitate to the new hot thing. So I think it was just more so that, and then me making beats came second because that was my personality. So I think at the time, Facebook was really popping and then it turned into Twitter and Instagram. But mind you, my YouTube got taken down - same thing happened with my Twitter and Instagram. So it was never really a trial and error thing. I just started over and picked one.
Clint:
What would you say are some of the top mistakes or regrets that you might have had coming up?
Reuel:
Well, I'm gonna just start it off saying this - I don't regret it necessarily because I ended up here and I like where I'm at now. But, a mistake that I made was moving in desperation. When money dries up, people start to get frantic and wild. You do things that you wouldn't normally do in your right mind. So coming up, I remember I signed a publishing deal with this local guy for $10,000. Worst mistake I could have ever made because that kind of deal was four 100% songs. So if you know how publishing works, you rarely get 50% on the publishing side. You can negotiate for more, but let's say I get 10% on a song. I would have to do 10 songs to equate to one 100% song to fulfill part of the agreement. I had to do that four times. So I did that for $10,000 man. It was a terrible situation that escalated into something that was toxic. Something that I would tell producers is get a lawyer and don't be so desperate. Anything was better than that situation.
Clint:
You can't make any more money until you recoup that $10,000 from those records that you produce under that agreement right?
Reuel:
Well, the $10,000 is an advance. So it's not even till I recoup the $10,000 it's till I fulfill the agreement. If they own the publishing, they’re getting the advance till I fulfill the agreement. So yeah, that was a really big mistake for me. Another big mistake for me was bad management. When I started out, my first manager was the guy that put me in this situation. After him, my second manager was taking meetings with labels and I never really heard anything back. We would go to the studio there and they would bring out an A&R or a liaison from the department to talk to me and I never heard about it. I eventually just got fed up because she was taking my opportunities and using them to bolster her own career. So don't look for management, let management find you. What separates a good manager from a great manager is a good manager will manage the opportunities that you get. A great manager will get you opportunities that you’re not supposed to have.
Clint:
I feel like producers kind of jump the gun with trying to find a manager just because it sounds good. Or they think a manager's gonna come in and just change their life and give them all these opportunities when they haven't even started to build anything to manage. What's your take on that?
Reuel:
I think the biggest question that you should always ask yourself is “why do I need this?” A lot of times, people go to the studio to work on a session and they'll do something because they think they're supposed to do it. I think the purpose is just as important. So I think producers doing stuff just because they think that they have to or that that's the only way to do it is something that they gotta break themselves out of thinking. You don't have to [have a manager or sign to a label] and you can be successful. I think the biggest thing is always looking for more information, always trying to learn, and not trying to take shortcuts. It's not gonna be easy. Nobody said it was supposed to be easy. Most businesses fail in the first year and if they don't fail the first year, they fail in the first five years. So you just gotta be willing to bounce back and adjust.
Clint:
You mentioned the gold records earlier - congrats again on that. How did those situations come about? Was that a natural progression from just building the influence online?
Reuel:
Well, all of my plaques came from networking. That's the crazy thing. I haven't gotten a plaque from YouTube or anything like that. Most of it comes from personal relationships - working with other producers and collaborating. I think the collaborative process is a big thing for me when it comes to making great records because you get to bounce ideas and you could compliment one another’s strengths and weaknesses. But yeah, going gold for me is really just a product of networking - traveling to Atlanta and having producers that are out there meet me. It's really a melting pot, so you’re bound to come across somebody that's got some real talent. I think that's how I ended up with these plaques, [aside from] just grinding hard.
Clint:
So what's next for you? Where do you see yourself in the next 5 or 10 years? What else is on your list to accomplish as a producer or just as an entrepreneur in general?
Reuel:
So much stuff that I want to do, man. I think one of my biggest goals is setting up something here - not even necessarily a studio, but just building some type of infrastructure so people here have an opportunity to make connections with majors, distribution, marketing, or anything like that. I don't think any of the tools available now are conducive to a lengthy career. I think a lot of opportunities in Michigan come with strings attached and you might not be dealing with the quality of people that you would otherwise in a city with a bigger scene, as far as music. Another thing for me is trying to pattern myself after those that I think are popular. I think Mustard is my go-to producer just because he's put out records [that] he's produced from start to finish and they’ve been his. So I think that's the next barrier for me, man. I really wanna build something great because I'm in it for the long run. I'm trying to grow my brand and help people grow theirs too.
Clint:
What would your advice be for a producer who may be trying to figure out how to get started and which direction to go?
Reuel:
In [the business world], the most successful business ideas solve a really crucial problem. Like how Uber solved traveling - not everybody was gonna call a taxi and they're not available everywhere, so they got ride sharing services. So if you're trying to figure out where to go, figure out what you want to hear or what somebody whose opinion you respect would want to hear. Another thing - now there's so much information out there. I think it's easier from when I first started back in 2009. Back then, if we’re rating on a scale of 1 to 10, it was hard to be a 10 and it was easy to be a three. But now, it's kind of easy to be a 7 and it's a lot harder to be a 10. It's easy to be average because a lot of the sounds are being passed around. Nowadays, you're more susceptible to doing what everybody else is doing. That's not necessarily a bad thing depending on what your goal is, but I really think you should just fine tune it to what you like and what you want to listen to. That would be my biggest advice for a producer trying to find a sound.
Clint:
Tell the people where they can find you, follow you, and check out some of your music.
Reuel:
Make sure you guys subscribe to my YouTube channel Reuel StopPlaying and @reuelstopplaying across all social media.
